Transcript
[0:02] [Music]
[0:12] me
[0:16] [Music]
[0:31] hi
[0:32] i'm nina rao welcome to my podcast on be
[0:36] here now network
[0:38] this is a very special episode that i
[0:40] recorded when i was in india
[0:43] in may this year 2022
[0:47] right after it felt safe to travel
[0:50] during this pandemic time
[0:52] i left for india and the first person
[0:54] who i went to see there is jaya prasada
[0:58] my elder guru sister
[1:00] who is the author of this book
[1:02] sri siddhima
[1:05] the subtitle is the story of neem karoli
[1:08] baba spiritual legacy
[1:11] i met jaya um in 1998 the very first
[1:15] time that i had my first darshan vichri
[1:18] siddima
[1:19] and i have always felt
[1:21] a kindred sisterhood with her
[1:25] and it was really beautiful to spend
[1:28] time with her and to talk to her about
[1:30] the book
[1:31] and also outside the book
[1:34] now because we hadn't really planned
[1:36] this recording
[1:38] we did it with iphones my daughter uma
[1:41] helped me and we were sitting out on the
[1:43] patio
[1:45] where ma used to sit
[1:47] so though it seems very serene for us
[1:50] when we're sitting out there
[1:52] um actually you will get to hear a lot
[1:54] of familiar sounds of an indian
[1:57] household in the hills
[1:59] everything from crows
[2:01] to the pressure cooker
[2:04] people
[2:05] walking on the street a car driving by
[2:08] with music so i hope you will forgive
[2:10] those sounds we've done our best
[2:12] to
[2:15] you know
[2:16] try to remove those sounds as much as
[2:18] possible but also to
[2:20] make it more audible what it is that
[2:22] jaya and i are talking about
[2:25] if you are listening to this in audio
[2:27] only
[2:28] please know that we do have this on
[2:31] video with captions
[2:34] on the be here now network podcast page
[2:37] so you're welcome to come and take a
[2:39] look over there
[2:40] okay
[2:41] i hope you'll enjoy and thank you so
[2:43] much for listening and for being with us
[2:46] jay sitaram jaima
[2:51] namaskar
[2:52] this is nina rao from be here now
[2:54] network
[2:56] and i am so overjoyed and honored to be
[2:59] coming to you from
[3:01] the beautiful retreat home of sri sudhi
[3:05] which she named
[3:08] i am here
[3:09] with her companion devoted companion of
[3:12] 37 years
[3:14] who took care of sri satyaman
[3:16] and immersed herself in her divine
[3:19] presence
[3:20] and was with her when ma took her last
[3:22] birth in this home
[3:25] my dear guru sister my elder guru sister
[3:28] prasada thank you for being here today
[3:32] and we're here of course to talk about
[3:34] her much awaited book
[3:36] i know all of you have been asking me to
[3:38] hear more about sri siddhima
[3:41] and
[3:42] what better place to find it
[3:44] but in general's debut book entitled
[3:47] sri siddhima
[3:49] the story of neem karoli baba's
[3:51] spiritual legacy
[3:54] so much of the book in the beginning
[3:57] is about ma and maharaj
[4:00] and also ma's early life
[4:02] and her association with shri jivantima
[4:05] and also her life as a householder for a
[4:08] few years
[4:10] after that jaya goes on to talk about
[4:13] mars ashram activities and the time that
[4:16] they spent on yatra or spiritual
[4:19] pilgrimage
[4:21] thereafter she talks to us about this
[4:23] retreat home this beautiful home where
[4:26] ma actually would give darshan on this
[4:28] very porch that we're sitting on and we
[4:30] would be sitting out there
[4:32] in this view of the kumar hills
[4:35] and the town in the valley below called
[4:40] and at the very end we get a glimpse
[4:43] of the revelation of the divinity of sri
[4:46] siddhima
[4:48] i won't say more because you're going to
[4:49] have to read the rest
[4:52] so dale
[4:53] when i saw you a couple of years ago or
[4:56] more than kogit i don't know where the
[4:58] time has gone
[5:00] but after ma left i asked when would you
[5:03] share your stories with her with us
[5:05] and you said to me i'm waiting for the
[5:08] right time and waiting for the sun
[5:10] so what was that sign for you
[5:12] samina i would put it this way
[5:15] you and most of the devotees the people
[5:18] that came to mind
[5:20] saw my life with ma once she was
[5:23] there
[5:24] her divine presence was physically
[5:27] present
[5:28] it was minute to minute i was in a
[5:30] second second and i had no time
[5:33] no eyes for anything else
[5:37] it was after mars mahasamadiya suddenly
[5:40] after many many years i found time on my
[5:43] hands
[5:45] and i
[5:46] felt
[5:48] that
[5:49] many who came to ma
[5:51] could not really see
[5:53] the
[5:54] her depth
[5:55] why because ma
[5:58] always
[5:59] stayed back never chose to reveal
[6:02] herself
[6:03] so it was hard for everyone to you know
[6:06] get a deeper insight into her
[6:10] what i was waiting for
[6:12] i was waiting for
[6:14] a spring to burst forth in my heart
[6:17] and if you ask me
[6:19] why i wrote this book
[6:23] it's a deep desire within me
[6:26] to share with everyone that gave my way
[6:29] the endless love that i received from
[6:36] can you share with us how the change
[6:38] occurred
[6:39] you made me laugh the other day by self
[6:41] proclaiming
[6:42] yourself as an angry
[6:45] how did this transition occur
[6:47] from that jail
[6:49] to the one
[6:51] who avoids traditional dedication to a
[6:54] saint
[6:55] so let me tell you about the angry bit
[6:58] of influence perhaps it was
[7:01] we as i've written in the book we were a
[7:03] traditional hindu family but we had a
[7:05] very westernized outlook
[7:07] my education was in
[7:11] english schools there was i was exposed
[7:14] more to western culture
[7:16] it was just the indian culture at home
[7:18] that i knew of
[7:20] and how
[7:22] from one life to the other
[7:24] it's it was no marked change it was not
[7:28] intended it was not pre-planned it's not
[7:31] a commitment not a result it was just a
[7:35] slow smooth transition
[7:37] and from the joys of my youth the
[7:40] enthusiasm of my younger days
[7:42] into a life of serenity and peace
[7:46] and that too at the feet of living saint
[7:50] so it was like
[7:52] moving away from the mundane
[7:55] into a new cosmos
[7:59] which i did not know even existed
[8:02] so i would say
[8:04] the whatever came
[8:06] [Music]
[8:07] in my life it was pre-ordained
[8:10] call it disney if you like
[8:16] jaya
[8:17] mummy was very important to you mommy
[8:20] your mother who we affectionately called
[8:22] mommy as well
[8:24] how was she a support for you how did
[8:27] she encourage you on this path
[8:30] she mommy was perhaps the biggest
[8:33] interest i suppose everyone's mother is
[8:36] but when you talk about mommy mommy was
[8:38] the biggest influence in my life
[8:41] but the spiritual aspect of me
[8:45] certainly she was the source
[8:47] she was being a very spiritual person
[8:50] herself
[8:51] right
[8:52] i just give an example that for a
[8:54] morning pooja
[8:56] she would recite the
[8:58] subsidy and i as a child
[9:01] maybe i was in bed or maybe i was
[9:03] playing in the room but the sounds
[9:06] permeated my brain
[9:07] and by the time i was say 13 14
[9:10] i knew that the gush subsidies
[9:14] almost by heart
[9:16] so that is how it all started
[9:18] then my early schooling
[9:21] i was sent to uh my grandfather
[9:24] and i lived in this house and my
[9:26] grandfather again was a very spiritually
[9:28] and kind person
[9:30] who owned a personal library of just
[9:33] spiritual books
[9:35] and there were about three to 500 books
[9:39] and was just he and me in the house
[9:42] and that is how i started you know
[9:45] reading all kinds of books you know
[9:48] not so much the scripture but you know
[9:51] by difference of states lives of saints
[9:54] quotes and sayings
[9:56] things like that so that all that built
[9:59] up
[10:00] now the change in my life of course it's
[10:03] very natural
[10:05] see there's a child in the family with a
[10:06] very promising future full of life full
[10:09] of enthusiasm
[10:11] and uh
[10:12] very fond of
[10:14] things like photography and driving and
[10:16] going up the mountains and spores and
[10:19] friends and all that
[10:21] suddenly
[10:23] taking a turn
[10:24] for the life i would not say
[10:26] renunciation
[10:28] but yes
[10:29] giving up this world for another
[10:32] it was a bit strange for the family
[10:35] which was mainly my mother and my two
[10:36] elder brothers
[10:38] they
[10:39] were
[10:40] apparently disturbed but as always it
[10:43] never hurt my feelings i was the
[10:44] youngest
[10:46] spoiled and pampered
[10:47] so
[10:48] so that was it it was my mother it was
[10:51] my mother who spoke of at last
[10:53] and she told my brothers
[10:55] she said look there's something i firmly
[10:58] want to say
[11:00] watch her don't stop
[11:02] see how she goes ahead
[11:04] and if she's happy and if she finds the
[11:07] life fulfilling
[11:09] do not deter her
[11:11] do not stop her because there's no life
[11:15] better than this
[11:17] and as we all know
[11:18] later
[11:20] mommy too
[11:22] came to ma and lived with ma
[11:25] and you share in the book about when
[11:28] that happened when you saw mark and
[11:30] you're being drawn towards kenji yes yes
[11:34] it was the moment yeah it's not a
[11:36] process it's not a transition it was a
[11:39] moment in my life
[11:42] and it was clear
[11:44] it was clear there was no thinking there
[11:46] was no looking back there were no doubts
[11:48] but no pros and cons
[11:50] this was it
[11:52] it was her
[11:53] okay
[11:57] she stole my heart
[11:59] [Music]
[12:01] sujaya when i first came to kenji
[12:04] i came
[12:05] looking for
[12:07] feeling the presence of maharaji
[12:09] that i had felt back in the united
[12:12] states when i first heard krishna sing
[12:15] and i was so disappointed when i learned
[12:18] that maharaji had left the body
[12:20] you know so i thought i'm going to come
[12:22] to country and at least be in the place
[12:25] where these people have this
[12:28] it was at that time
[12:32] well
[12:33] you're going
[12:34] then
[12:35] you must meet satan
[12:38] and
[12:40] i didn't really know what to expect
[12:43] i arrived there
[12:44] in my first darshan with her
[12:47] my vision
[12:48] was of her in the room but in the
[12:51] presence of maharaja
[12:52] but then over the years
[12:55] i developed a different relationship
[12:57] with her
[12:59] such that i called her my guru
[13:02] and
[13:04] in all the time though that i was with
[13:06] her she never once said i say this
[13:10] i think this it was always she referred
[13:13] everything back to maharaja every single
[13:15] time
[13:17] so much so
[13:18] that there was a time when actually you
[13:20] were walking her across the courtyard
[13:23] and it was raining
[13:25] and she was just holding her saree up
[13:27] just a little bit
[13:29] and she did the end and yeah i looked at
[13:32] her feet
[13:33] and i looked at her feet and there were
[13:35] maharaja's feet
[13:37] so many have done this the way you you
[13:40] did one yeah
[13:41] yeah so
[13:43] can you share a little bit more about
[13:46] the
[13:47] the way in which
[13:49] she her relationship with maharaja we
[13:51] all know she took care of him for many
[13:54] many years
[13:56] and there are stories told about how
[13:58] maharaja viewed more
[14:01] but from your perspective
[14:04] what
[14:05] what kind of a relationship do you think
[14:07] there
[14:08] see nina this is a bit hard to answer
[14:11] i had maharaja jesus as a child
[14:14] so i am through the eyes of a child of
[14:16] course
[14:17] the blessing started pouring then only
[14:20] but
[14:21] it was not in my awareness
[14:23] then a whole
[14:26] say a couple of decades passed
[14:29] when i went through the grind in the
[14:31] world
[14:32] studies so on and so forth and and then
[14:35] when ma appeared in my life
[14:37] so
[14:38] connecting the two physical presences
[14:42] is not so easy
[14:44] but i would say
[14:46] where does the question of the
[14:48] relationship between the two arrives
[14:51] when two
[14:52] have merged one they have beautifully
[14:55] blended into one
[14:57] so where's the relationship
[15:00] it is like
[15:02] 12
[15:04] ma
[15:05] starts
[15:08] maharaj stops and then mara stops
[15:12] masters
[15:14] so thousands of people came to
[15:19] they they
[15:20] wanted to feel maharajji's presence
[15:23] and they came in mars presence and mars
[15:27] words
[15:28] mars
[15:30] constant repetition of maharaja maharaja
[15:34] maharaja said
[15:37] she reincarnated maharaja in their
[15:39] hearts in their eyes and in kenji
[15:44] keji was
[15:46] was i was infused with the presence of
[15:49] the being of maharaja so nobody felt the
[15:52] vacuum once they were with her
[15:55] well many devotees have actually said
[15:57] this to me yes you know that after
[15:59] maharaji left the body yes when and when
[16:02] my mom left the body they said
[16:05] who will hold mahaji in the way that she
[16:07] did okay many devotees have suffered
[16:11] so something beautiful is happening
[16:14] the way uh ma held maharaja
[16:18] after his mahasamadhi
[16:20] after ma's mahal samadhi it is my strong
[16:24] feeling that maharaja is holding mom
[16:27] and holding her up
[16:31] so many people
[16:34] we experienced
[16:36] two aspects of mom
[16:38] one
[16:39] aspect of her as a fully surrendered
[16:43] devotee
[16:44] and then at other times
[16:47] she would appear as the one
[16:50] divine supreme being
[16:53] as if they're two separate things
[16:55] did you have that type of experience
[16:58] and if you did how would you reconcile
[17:00] them
[17:01] well
[17:11] she
[17:12] carried forth maharaja's mission on
[17:14] earth which is perhaps amazing to redeem
[17:17] mankind that is what maharaji had come
[17:20] for
[17:21] and that was what maha did moment to
[17:23] moment you saw everybody sorry
[17:27] now maharaja
[17:29] was always bowing to maharaja complete
[17:33] surrender
[17:35] complete surrender comes with total
[17:38] self-realization
[17:40] and ma
[17:41] was a self-realized soul
[17:43] it was there but yes you are right
[17:46] sometimes
[17:48] our perspective shifted
[17:51] and from
[17:52] the devoted disciple
[17:54] of maharaja she emerged as the
[17:56] all-powerful mother
[17:59] and that is perfectly in line
[18:01] because as we read at the end of the
[18:04] book
[18:04] maharaj
[18:08] [Music]
[18:10] all proclaimed her as the mother
[18:13] universe
[18:15] the yoga challenge
[18:17] and then that is what she presented
[18:19] herself as at those moments
[18:21] that's how you suffer and that's
[18:25] important you guys
[18:28] so jaya when you say that
[18:30] maharaja came about next year
[18:34] to redeem mankind
[18:36] can you describe a little bit of what
[18:39] their activities were like how were they
[18:41] helping the devotees and people who came
[18:44] to them who sought refuge in them
[18:47] how was that
[18:48] say ah nina
[18:51] much was on the same level
[18:54] and
[18:55] much much more than the unseen
[18:58] if
[18:59] they did it it happened without claiming
[19:03] that they did it and without saying that
[19:05] it had happened
[19:06] so again it's very hard to give precise
[19:09] examples but as you know i was with ma
[19:13] when she was in audience when she was
[19:15] being
[19:15] [Music]
[19:16] day in and day out i saw the suffering
[19:20] of the people the misery that they were
[19:22] being subjected to not deserving it yet
[19:26] getting the worse
[19:27] there's hardly a eye that had no tears
[19:30] there's hardly a heart that had no pain
[19:34] and it was amazing it was amazing
[19:39] just being in the presence
[19:41] or a few words of guidance
[19:44] from mom
[19:46] you know
[19:48] there would be a
[19:50] a magical i would say transformation you
[19:52] know a magical healing
[19:54] so when i say redeem i would say that ma
[19:58] and maharaja
[20:00] incarnated on earth to
[20:03] remove the
[20:05] negativity the painful
[20:07] negativity of the effects of the
[20:10] age
[20:12] people were saying darkness ma and
[20:14] maharaja came as rays of life rays of
[20:18] hope
[20:19] and
[20:20] abundance of love
[20:21] with every heart received
[20:24] and that love worked amazing
[20:27] [Music]
[20:29] one of the things i've seen in common
[20:31] from what maharaji shared with people
[20:34] and ma then
[20:35] she accentuated it even more in my time
[20:39] was that in this age yes
[20:43] the practice
[20:44] that was going to help us the most was
[20:47] repetition
[20:52] so can you share some instances of
[20:55] ma
[20:57] you know instructed people in this game
[21:00] well you know
[21:10] you do this you do that
[21:12] as a regimen you have to follow nothing
[21:14] she looks softly suggest
[21:17] and the sweetness entered your heart and
[21:19] you wanted to do it
[21:23] [Music]
[21:27] is very powerful
[21:34] has the power to change destiny
[21:38] ramana has the power to alleviate
[21:40] suffering
[21:42] so chant the name of ram
[21:44] then as we know
[21:46] maharaja
[21:48] was
[21:50] and maharaja himself and
[21:53] then onwards laid great
[21:56] emphasis
[21:57] on the recitation of the child
[22:00] and ma would say
[22:05] is the
[22:06] veda
[22:07] [Music]
[22:11] next to hanuman chalisa was the sunder
[22:14] card
[22:15] that is
[22:17] the story of him
[22:18] [Music]
[22:25] he searched
[22:26] [Music]
[22:36] [Music]
[22:38] one day
[22:39] talking to me said she said
[22:41] yes
[22:43] that is very bad
[22:45] but when ma
[22:47] tells somebody
[22:50] it becomes a powerful mantra which is
[22:53] empowered
[22:56] and i felt
[22:58] that
[22:58] when ma told you to do something you did
[23:01] it
[23:01] [Music]
[23:05] you had it so i need to say more i'm
[23:07] sure there are many who are with us just
[23:09] now absolutely would share this with us
[23:11] [Music]
[23:14] i hear her words in my ears
[23:18] and the sound of the voice
[23:20] and the way she very sweetly
[23:22] but firmly
[23:24] sometimes also sharing yeah family yeah
[23:27] foreign
[23:28] [Music]
[23:32] it was very interesting uh you know when
[23:33] i first came tomorrow i mean
[23:37] [Music]
[23:45] [Music]
[23:53] eleven times would be good in the
[23:55] morning and i would do for now and get
[23:57] up and uh that you would say
[24:00] why 11 times
[24:02] 108
[24:05] oh yes my yes i'll do it and i'm walking
[24:08] backwards you know
[24:10] and on tuesdays or maybe every day
[24:12] during the sunday yes
[24:13] so that's how that's how my day was
[24:16] planned as i was backing out the room
[24:18] right
[24:19] right we thought we were fortunate you
[24:21] of course spent so much time with one
[24:23] see one minute
[24:26] yes time does not matter
[24:28] it may be a second
[24:30] it may be a lifetime
[24:33] so
[24:34] time
[24:35] is not amazing
[24:36] just remember that i agree i agree
[24:38] because i had very short moments of time
[24:44] almost every year
[24:46] but it was enough to carry me through
[24:49] the rest of the year that i wasn't with
[24:51] her
[24:52] and then when she left
[24:54] her physical body i felt like i still
[24:58] entered into her home through the
[25:00] practice she gave us that
[25:03] she gave us that refuge
[25:05] by creating this space for us
[25:08] [Music]
[25:12] you know many many after mother living a
[25:16] physical body
[25:18] many felt her presence
[25:21] more close to them
[25:23] more enveloping
[25:25] it was a constant thing in their
[25:27] lifetime
[25:29] and there was no effort required to
[25:31] reach out to her because she was there
[25:34] all the time right if she was there
[25:37] she was there all the time
[25:39] i think for me because i knew i had just
[25:42] a little bit of time with her that the
[25:44] rest of the time i was without her
[25:46] i had to be in that space anyway
[25:50] there were times
[25:52] you mean i don't know if you remember
[25:53] this but there was a time when
[25:55] she decided that we were not going to go
[25:58] back to delhi the way that we had
[25:59] planned
[26:01] she had a different plan for us so of
[26:02] course we listened
[26:05] but as a result of that she packed had
[26:08] some food packed first
[26:11] and this still moves me so much because
[26:14] when i opened the basket
[26:16] you told me ma has packed this way
[26:19] she oversaw it
[26:21] and in there was a little of salt
[26:25] and that just touched me so much that
[26:28] she should even think that we would want
[26:30] this so this kind of care and
[26:31] consideration for every detail for
[26:34] everything
[26:36] everything
[26:37] yeah nina for everyone yeah
[26:40] in in my group there's a chapter
[26:44] i could just mention a few
[26:47] who were really disregarded by society
[26:50] who were really
[26:51] not looked upon
[26:53] in a very acceptable way you know
[26:56] so their presence for the bother to them
[26:59] mom loved them
[27:00] mark cared for them more cared for their
[27:02] needs
[27:04] in the darshan room all kinds of people
[27:06] came they reached the poor the wealthy
[27:08] and everything
[27:09] but ma was so institute intuitive
[27:13] to the pride of each one
[27:15] to the pain of each one
[27:17] at the prestige of each one
[27:19] she honored the
[27:21] high ups
[27:22] but she loved the others as well and
[27:25] kept everybody somehow on the same level
[27:28] so what were you saying how she cared
[27:30] for everyone yeah
[27:32] well nina for me
[27:35] the perhaps the best thing in the
[27:37] creation of god is the mother
[27:39] we start with the mother that gives us
[27:41] birth
[27:42] you know
[27:43] ask anybody your mother oh i love my
[27:45] mother
[27:49] when the divine incarnates in the form
[27:52] of a mother
[27:54] the love and the compassion
[27:57] that that divine mother gives
[28:00] just multiplies a thousand folds
[28:03] it just
[28:05] envelops love
[28:07] you are in the cocoon of our love
[28:10] you feel the warmth of this
[28:13] i'm sure each one has
[28:14] had it in our lives
[28:18] and
[28:19] you talk about personal care
[28:22] uh
[28:23] there's a little that are written
[28:25] uh on the chapter on the night of 14th
[28:28] june
[28:29] her mother was awake the whole night
[28:32] even sensitive to the cries of babies in
[28:35] the courtyard
[28:37] and she would be you know immediately up
[28:41] wanting to find out if the baby was cold
[28:44] she would send a baby blanket if the
[28:46] baby needed milk she ensured that there
[28:48] was wrong way for the child
[28:52] you know these little things people
[28:54] still shed tears over them
[28:56] and she did that for us us old people
[28:59] also she treated us in the same way with
[29:02] so much fun
[29:03] for every little thing well alina for 37
[29:07] years i was a six-year-old child for her
[29:10] as long as mother was there in a
[29:13] physical presence
[29:15] my childhood had not ended
[29:20] during that time though also jail
[29:23] in your association with her and the way
[29:26] in which you cared for her you spent
[29:28] such close time yes i did and
[29:31] my understanding is that you were her
[29:33] driver you took her everywhere oh yes oh
[29:37] yes and you also helped with just even
[29:39] her day-to-day
[29:41] yes whatever her needs were yes whether
[29:43] it was her food
[29:45] in prasad
[29:46] and every little thing
[29:48] yes and don't you think that all your
[29:50] skills from your your prior life
[29:53] came into effect here what yes yeah i
[29:56] would say yes yeah
[29:58] two very important skills one was my
[30:00] driving and one with my camera
[30:03] so i started my driving you know
[30:05] initially i knew very little about
[30:07] mother in the beginning how she travels
[30:10] how she goes from one place to the other
[30:12] and i felt that people didn't want to
[30:14] share this aspect of her
[30:17] so i really didn't know where to go
[30:19] now so we had my mother and i drove to
[30:21] bunyad we knew the kumar was there
[30:23] i had come to know from somewhere that
[30:25] mom would be moving that day from
[30:27] bhumyadha to kg
[30:29] so i spent the whole night cleaning it
[30:32] was a november night
[30:34] i cleaned my car new footpaths so on so
[30:37] forth my child like mine whatever i
[30:39] could do we drove to mumiada
[30:42] so it was a little prasad morning
[30:45] then we sat with mother then there was
[30:48] some tea and but there was no sign that
[30:50] ma is going to leave
[30:52] after lunch prasad ma called me she said
[30:56] i will be going to catch you this
[30:57] afternoon so you better go home before
[31:00] it gets dark
[31:01] so i said oh this is the opportunity
[31:04] i said
[31:06] the car is there for you may i please
[31:08] drive you to kenji this is the first
[31:10] time you know i dared to say this
[31:13] so she said no no you go home today
[31:17] uh there's a uh
[31:20] driver govardhana
[31:22] he's a bhakta
[31:23] and i've told him to stop his bus here
[31:26] and i would be going to kg in his bus
[31:30] so i still remember how my heart just
[31:34] dipped my muscles sunk yes but i didn't
[31:37] show you know and um
[31:39] i did pronounce
[31:40] it
[31:42] but as i turn my back towards mom
[31:46] i couldn't hold my tears
[31:48] so there was this dip dip dip dip and i
[31:50] walked out
[31:52] as i stepped out of the temple veranda
[31:55] and i was going to step onto the road
[31:57] i looked back
[31:59] and ma was
[32:01] blaming
[32:02] actually
[32:05] flew off her head
[32:06] and you know the bars in the temple she
[32:09] held onto the bars and her words were
[32:16] [Music]
[32:22] and so it happened
[32:24] so i had the honor the privilege the joy
[32:27] the everything of being a driver for 37
[32:30] years
[32:32] and it was not just
[32:41] and the most beautiful memories of
[32:43] driving her in the mountains
[32:46] and the scenic beauty and mother would
[32:48] enjoy and we would feel like little
[32:50] monkeys with us you know
[32:53] so
[32:54] that was nothing the second was my
[32:56] photography
[32:58] i was it was my hobbies i think my first
[33:00] camera came at the age of eight
[33:02] i gave a birthday present from my
[33:04] grandfather and that's how it started
[33:06] but that came into use
[33:09] again this is my book
[33:11] ma
[33:12] permitted me which never allowed anyone
[33:15] to take photographs
[33:17] of her yes you know usually
[33:19] not in the ocean but when she was on a
[33:22] retreat on her travels so luckily we
[33:26] have these thousands of memories
[33:29] and
[33:30] we can revive we can relive those times
[33:33] through these photographs
[33:35] and as i speak to you
[33:36] it is my deep
[33:39] wish to share each of these moments with
[33:42] the world moments i mean photographs yes
[33:45] but i'll take them out slowly so that we
[33:47] can have a little at a time and
[33:51] we we live those moments with us
[33:54] and also
[33:55] my i know that you have saved
[33:59] precious items
[34:01] of your time with her and she shared
[34:04] with you that you've held close to your
[34:06] heart
[34:07] and then are blessed by her so simple
[34:10] right here
[34:11] is a beautiful photograph he's taken off
[34:13] mark's feet and what did you do well
[34:17] i think
[34:19] now
[34:26] tree and her two feet one was here and
[34:29] the other was there on this stone and
[34:30] beautiful storm
[34:32] so
[34:33] i couldn't take my eyes off mars feet
[34:36] and i stood there
[34:38] after a little while i got up to go up
[34:41] as soon as the back was done
[34:43] i picked up the stone
[34:45] and ran by the back way here is the
[34:48] stone here's the stone and i put it
[34:49] under the seat in my car
[34:52] and so this is the precious stone one
[34:55] foot here
[34:56] and the other one here
[34:59] and we get to bow to this stone we get
[35:01] to bow to the store
[35:02] similarly nina we would go out for a
[35:05] walk so i loved walking
[35:07] in the woods
[35:08] in the hills in the mountains early in
[35:10] the morning
[35:11] and i would
[35:12] really trail behind her and keep her
[35:14] company and she chose to take her
[35:17] so that was something very very
[35:19] i was saying very blessed
[35:21] and she would surely helped and she
[35:24] loved flowers she would pick wild
[35:26] flowers and show me the petals see how
[35:28] god has made them see we forget god we
[35:31] forget his creation
[35:33] and you'll give the flower to me and
[35:35] nina i saved each one of them each fern
[35:38] that you break each pebble that you
[35:41] picked and showed me hanuman's face or
[35:43] ram on it i saved them all and they are
[35:47] here with me so
[35:49] we call it the archive mars archive of
[35:52] mars relics it is here with me in mars
[35:54] housing
[35:55] it has almost everything that she ever
[36:00] touched or blessed or wore
[36:03] or was a part of us
[36:06] so i tell you uh
[36:08] we were in emporiani acanthos
[36:11] and ma it was right the house was right
[36:13] in the interior can you explain just
[36:15] what economist
[36:17] was it's like after uh i was in my book
[36:20] uh ma would go
[36:22] take off for a retreat into the
[36:24] mountains after she had had her aft
[36:25] after the big pandra june pandara many
[36:29] reasons for this
[36:31] the the staff needed rest the ashram
[36:34] needed cleaning up and all and it must
[36:36] stayed on
[36:37] the the people would keep pouring and
[36:39] there was no stopping to it
[36:40] and then the mothers were also tired and
[36:43] we were with her
[36:44] we deserved a a
[36:47] change
[36:48] so so we loved it we waited all the year
[36:51] for this
[36:52] so the website
[36:54] you were telling me about ikantha's body
[36:56] yes so mars trained her ankle
[36:59] now there was no medical aid or anything
[37:01] no doctors around and we had no bandages
[37:04] also somehow nothing was ever later yes
[37:07] we did carry our first aid kit but then
[37:09] we were what we were
[37:11] so somebody some local man suggested
[37:14] that you take
[37:15] i think just open ash
[37:18] and apply warm ash on the
[37:21] the strain of the injury and wrap it at
[37:24] night and removed in the morning
[37:26] so we really burned some wood and we got
[37:29] that ash filter and applied it on nice
[37:32] and clean and put it back in and she
[37:34] slept at night
[37:35] so there were five six of us and i don't
[37:38] remember who but they opened the bandage
[37:40] next morning and they were going to
[37:42] throw the ash so i'll put my hands full
[37:44] that's give it to me
[37:45] so that ash that was on a part of her
[37:48] body for almost 12 hours is here with me
[37:52] as well as the bandage
[37:53] for me
[37:54] it's something very very very precious
[37:57] and it is here with us
[38:00] so similarly we have not lost anything
[38:04] of hers it's all there
[38:06] some of maharajji's
[38:08] things collected by ma given to me over
[38:10] the years like ma collected us from
[38:13] maharaja said on a leaf of sand and bin
[38:16] laden
[38:17] and so when maharaji got up
[38:19] ma collected the the sand in her paloo
[38:23] and she saved it and brenda one and
[38:24] later and she gave it to me
[38:26] to take care of it so that sand from
[38:29] being marathi's field is here dust from
[38:33] our mataji's faith which i collected
[38:36] over time are the banks of ganga and
[38:38] other peace is here
[38:40] so we have a huge big treasure here
[38:43] it's such an expression of reverence
[38:47] and devotion
[38:48] something that is very unique actually
[38:51] to i think here in the east
[38:56] contains
[38:57] it was it was anything that i did uh
[39:00] nina it was inspired by her
[39:03] i was an instrument
[39:06] don't think worthy in any way
[39:08] but yes she chose me
[39:14] so jaya you know
[39:15] in my time with ma and i think many
[39:17] people have felt this actually you know
[39:19] often we would go for darshan and we
[39:22] want to prepare something
[39:23] good and appropriate to ask her and and
[39:27] whatnot and many a time we would ask a
[39:29] question
[39:30] and she may not even actually really
[39:32] answer it and say something completely
[39:34] different why
[39:36] because she saw what actually was going
[39:39] on she could see into our hearts and she
[39:43] would answer the question that we hadn't
[39:45] even thought to ask
[39:47] and only when we heard what she had to
[39:49] say
[39:50] did we realize that that's really what
[39:52] we were looking to know
[39:54] so
[39:55] this
[39:56] feels to me like an expression of her
[39:59] divine intuition and insight into us
[40:02] and do you have some stories like that
[40:05] to share yeah there were there were
[40:06] thousands of happenings like this so we
[40:09] really you know it was like an accepted
[40:11] thing for us that mother knows
[40:14] and mother's intuition is beyond beyond
[40:17] beyond everything
[40:18] and
[40:19] so many people would come to ma
[40:22] and receive
[40:23] whatever they had probably thought of
[40:25] nothing you wished for without having to
[40:28] ask for it this is happening all the
[40:30] time a very small
[40:32] memory comes to my mind
[40:35] there is a picture of hanumani
[40:40] embracing each other it's a beautiful
[40:42] picture and it is uh one of these
[40:45] photographs are framed in mars couti in
[40:47] which he lived in ketchi and i love that
[40:50] picture and i wanted to get a small one
[40:53] for my own personal puja older
[40:56] so it happened that i was going to priya
[40:59] and uh and mahi told me to go to priyank
[41:02] and chitra
[41:03] that time ma was not gonna accompany me
[41:06] though she said she'd meet me there
[41:08] so that was the biggest job of my going
[41:10] there
[41:10] but um there was i with this photograph
[41:13] in my mind this photo in my mind so i
[41:16] went from shop to shop there were huts
[41:18] by the bank of ganga they were selling
[41:20] these pictures and it's a common one
[41:22] so i must have gone for 25 of these uh
[41:26] little happenings where the pictures
[41:28] were being sold but i couldn't find that
[41:30] photo
[41:31] eventually we went to recruit and
[41:34] a month later perhaps i came to catching
[41:37] and ma was standing
[41:40] besides maharaja stuck it on the veranda
[41:42] as i came in i always ran and i never
[41:45] walked in tomorrow
[41:47] so
[41:47] i ran and there was she's standing
[41:49] outside which was absolutely wonderful
[41:52] and i climbed with the steps to do
[41:54] pranam to her and i noticed that she has
[41:57] something in her hand which is holding
[41:59] on close to her heart
[42:01] and as i bow at her feet and i get up
[42:04] and she hands me the picture and she
[42:06] says
[42:09] take is this what you were looking for
[42:12] and it was that picture of hanuman and
[42:15] ramji embracing each other
[42:17] so it's a small example yet it's a big
[42:19] thing and this is not me this is this is
[42:22] happening day and night
[42:25] yeah yeah for sure
[42:26] so you explained son you described
[42:29] something to me once that happened in
[42:31] the middle of the night
[42:32] yes that also was
[42:35] all
[42:36] was
[42:37] policing here
[42:40] audition something you know
[42:49] [Music]
[42:54] i would sleep on the floor in the center
[42:55] between two of them
[42:57] so like the baby of the family
[43:00] some sleep there
[43:02] so and normally the mothers were quiet
[43:04] once they were in the kudi and they
[43:05] wouldn't take long to really fall asleep
[43:09] so i suddenly mad that he gets
[43:11] [Music]
[43:26] [Music]
[43:34] such a big catastrophe
[43:36] such a big calamity so many have died
[43:39] such destruction all over many children
[43:42] have died they say big earthquake is a
[43:45] big earthquake
[43:47] so to my human mind i said no no mom
[43:50] everything is fine there's no earthquake
[43:52] here
[43:53] everything is fine enough my thought
[43:56] process inside is that ma is having a
[43:58] nightmare you know
[44:00] so i said
[44:01] nothing
[44:03] everything is
[44:11] she sat for a while but she was
[44:14] very disturbed
[44:16] then after a while she chose to lie down
[44:19] i lay down too but she didn't sleep and
[44:21] other to die
[44:23] so back in the 80s there were no phones
[44:26] there were no wires or any communication
[44:28] means like that
[44:30] in the morning perhaps the bus the first
[44:32] buses coming wire catching and people
[44:34] getting off they came they brought them
[44:37] they brought the news that there was a
[44:39] massive earthquake in uttarakhand and
[44:42] the entire
[44:44] civilization civilization there had been
[44:47] reduced to japan
[44:50] and you didn't have that experience the
[44:52] earthquake hadn't reached where you were
[44:53] no there were no tremors no nothing no
[44:56] indications whatsoever
[44:58] whatsoever nothing
[45:00] so ma was sometimes her mood was changed
[45:03] you know and we couldn't fathom the
[45:05] reason why this is happening even the
[45:08] look on her face would change
[45:10] and that would worry but obviously she
[45:12] was somewhere else she was not with us
[45:15] she was
[45:16] she was redeeming mankind somewhere else
[45:18] no that's it
[45:22] every time that we went to see one and
[45:25] you know maharaja bhaktas would also say
[45:27] that when they stand there he would
[45:28] throw fruit at them constantly
[45:31] so when we would come to the ashram same
[45:33] thing we would go to see mom and she
[45:35] would share stories about maharaji she
[45:37] would ask us about ourselves
[45:39] and then the prasad would come
[45:42] and we would have loads of fruit and
[45:45] whatever was just past what was brought
[45:48] in was passed along to us
[45:50] and
[45:51] over the years you know we have um
[45:55] felt that generosity that blessing that
[45:59] we received from the prasad that was
[46:01] given to us
[46:03] and
[46:04] i just it always felt like there was
[46:06] enough for everybody
[46:08] how how was that experience for me
[46:12] started
[46:17] [Music]
[46:22] emphasize
[46:23] the sanctity of prasad saying that
[46:26] consecrated food
[46:28] has the power to transform the heart
[46:32] the sad say hi
[46:37] how is food consecrated for people to
[46:39] understand so we call it
[46:42] so whatever is
[46:44] whatever food comes it is first placed
[46:47] in front of the deity yes and you
[46:50] you pray to them you invoke them to
[46:53] partake of it and thereby sanctify it
[46:56] and receive it as their
[46:59] grace in the form of food
[47:01] yes
[47:02] so
[47:03] in fact i remember reading somewhere
[47:05] that ma sharda would say that
[47:08] some energy
[47:11] comes and permeates the prasad in the
[47:13] process of poke
[47:14] and therefore the prasad is is now just
[47:18] it's like powered forward yes so that
[47:21] way so in this time or we
[47:30] in mars time the number of visitors
[47:32] increased many food
[47:34] so it was really organized and now but
[47:37] ma
[47:42] no matter what it was what prasad would
[47:45] be there for everyone
[47:47] and
[47:48] one of the attributes of divine advocate
[47:50] especially of i think the goddess
[47:54] it's shri
[47:55] that is abundance
[47:58] auspiciousness
[47:59] was buried in
[48:00] plenty
[48:02] and that was always
[48:04] so you were on this side of the curtain
[48:07] we were behind the garden there was
[48:09] nothing
[48:10] that was ordered the sweets one ordered
[48:13] the fruit wasn't ordered it just poured
[48:15] it
[48:16] people brought them somebody was
[48:18] inspired to offer whatever
[48:21] and that came into a room which is
[48:24] called the prasada
[48:25] and that was brought forth and mars
[48:27] hailed rizzo was always giving giving
[48:30] giving the whole day long she was giving
[48:33] at the end of the day
[48:35] she would walk back when she was done
[48:36] with everyone
[48:38] and there were there were big
[48:40] containers which was we would store the
[48:42] fruit that came say apples and plums and
[48:46] apricots and salt
[48:52] [Music]
[48:57] if you don't empty it how will you feel
[49:00] it
[49:03] and there was always abundance
[49:06] i have spoken about jivanti mataki
[49:09] she would intuitively order the amount
[49:11] of prasad for the visitors that would
[49:13] arrive the next day to feed them but to
[49:16] feed them
[49:17] how do i know tomorrow one thousand come
[49:19] out tomorrow two thousand cow but
[49:21] there's always enough and also
[49:25] which is poorly is mainly for reason a
[49:27] little would be left over which mother
[49:30] would keep in the those couches i call
[49:33] it
[49:34] and in the evening all the little
[49:36] children need the asham would come my
[49:38] book
[49:40] i'm hungry
[49:42] and so ma would send out that bucket of
[49:43] puris for the children
[49:46] so much full thought so much for thought
[49:48] so much love such a personal touch
[49:52] from such a
[49:53] high soul you know
[49:56] she never
[49:57] she never you know
[49:59] maintained a level
[50:01] she was with us all the time
[50:06] that was mom
[50:09] i think we could keep talking about
[50:11] endlessly
[50:12] as we have
[50:15] but um
[50:16] i'm so happy that you shared some of
[50:18] these times you know
[50:19] um with us in the book
[50:22] so we look forward to all of you reading
[50:25] these stories in the book
[50:27] one last question jim
[50:30] what would you say is the greatest gift
[50:32] that might be
[50:35] oh nina
[50:36] the thing is this
[50:38] what was it that she didn't give me
[50:44] if you want another line to it
[50:46] it was the life that she gave me
[50:50] for
[50:51] if you
[50:52] say it will be when it's ordered many
[50:54] lives
[50:56] that would culminate in this
[50:59] to live and love
[51:02] mother
[51:10] she was my guru she was my guide
[51:12] she was my son she was also my best
[51:14] friend
[51:18] so thank you all for joining us uh in
[51:21] this journey with jaya prasada and her
[51:25] time with ma
[51:26] and i'm so honored that you shared this
[51:28] with us jaya
[51:30] i
[51:31] had the honor of being with ma off and
[51:34] on for short periods of time
[51:37] but somewhat regularly from 1998 to
[51:41] 2017
[51:43] and we've all longed to hear more about
[51:47] ma that we couldn't see
[51:49] and i'm so grateful that we've been able
[51:51] to
[51:52] have a peek into the depth and the
[51:55] expansiveness of the life
[51:59] you know we couldn't put our finger on
[52:00] it
[52:01] but her mere presence made it very clear
[52:04] to us
[52:06] that she
[52:07] is the source
[52:09] she is the mother
[52:10] she is juggerton that's my feeling
[52:14] and i'm sure many are for many of you
[52:17] this resonates
[52:18] thank you so much for joining us
[52:21] the um
[52:22] details about where you can find the
[52:24] book
[52:25] will be in the text for this podcast but
[52:28] they are
[52:29] going to be able to be ordered from
[52:31] amazon.com in the digital format and
[52:34] also the print version will be available
[52:36] very soon so please stay tuned for that
[52:40] thank you nina thank you
[52:50] you